How Kazakhstan concealed Xinjiang concentration camps: ChinaAid’s exclusive interview with Serikzhan Bilash (part 2)

Serikzhan Bilash in New York, 2021 (Photo: Kalbynur Auken)
(ChinaAid) The following is part two of ChinaAid’s exclusive interview with Serikzhan Bilash, leader Atajurt Kazakh Human Rights. Bilash and ChinaAid Special Correspondent Gao Zhensai discuss how the Kazakhstan government attempted to control the narrative about Uyghurs and Kazakhs in Xinjiang concentration camps. Click here to read part one. 

 

Special Correspondent: Mr. Serikzhan, in the last interview, you mentioned your two like-minded friends, the activist Mr. Dulat Agadil and the writer Mr. Kuandyk Shamalhay, who are also your supporters. We would like to relay our deep condolences for their mysterious deaths. Politics is not absolute, but life is; divisions are not surprising, everyone’s ambition is to promote the progress of countries and human beings, and life is the bottom line that should not be crossed. When the last interview was done, it was coincidentally your friend’s birthday, but he had already passed. Your friend’s departure is an indication of potential threats against you. Have the authorities used other tools against you in the past few years? 

 

Serikzhan Bilash: The Kazakh authorities are afraid of us. We have influence in the West. We exposed the concentration camps. They want to arrest people like us, but they also have to take into account the pressure. The government has mixed feelings towards us. They have been using intimidation tactics. Even if they don’t use hardline tactics, they use soft tactics. The purpose of these soft tactics is an attempt to take advantage of the situation and mislead the West. 

 

Could you give any examples of this?  

 

Serikzhan Bilash: The State Security Agency of Kazakhstan bribed three members of our organization who betrayed us, and these three people were instigated. Two of these three people were instructed by the Kazakh government to register as human rights organizations with similar names, imitating our organization to make it easy to confuse the two. 

 

One of them, Kydyrali Orazuly, registered an organization in December 2018 within a short span of time called the “Atajurt Zhastary Youth Volunteer Organization” (Atajurt Zhastary). It was a foundation, a Chinese research institute. It also used “Atajurt,” which means “home of the father,” and it has two more characters, “Qing Nian” (youth), in its name. A week later, he registered another foundation. It usually takes two years to register an organization in Kazakhstan, and they were completed in one week. The other’s name was “Love Foundation” (“Bauyrmal”).  

 

This “traitor,” pardon me for calling him that, registered “Kazakhstan Institute of Chinese Study” a week later. In Kazakhstan, members of prominent families and high-level officials are needed as backers, and the application procedures are incredibly complicated to register for the institute. But he reached an agreement with the State Security Agency and registered three organizations at once, all in the city of Almaty. 

 

It is clear that you thought it was a fake separatist group formed by members who take a soft stance on China. What kind of challenge do these groups pose to you? 

 

Serikzhan Bilash: Kydyrali told Radio Free Europe that there are no concentration camps in Xinjiang and that ninety percent of all Kazakhs in Xinjiang have been released. The Kazakh government and China like to hear such words. 

 

That sounds paradoxical; since he denied the concentration camps, why did he say that ninety percent were released? Wouldn’t that be an admission that someone was detained and then released? And what about the other person? 

 

Serikzhan Bilash: Four months before my arrest in 2019, I found out the second man, Erbol Dauletbek, betrayed me. The State Security Agency would find him and started to bribe him. He defected in October 2018, when the State Security Agency made him an activist to have the people follow him. 

 

The second criminal investigation against me was “illegal appropriation of property.” It was Erbol Dauletbek who was trying to make things difficult for me; he said I was illegally occupying his organization’s YouTube channel. My channel started way back in 2013, many years before his organization. He got the approval of the government, applied for an organization, and tried to take over our YouTube channel to seize influence on a powerful platform used for speaking out. 

 

Maybe readers would be interested to know how he got into your organization?  

 

Serikzhan Bilash: He only joined us in September 2018. His mother was in her 80s and was placed under house arrest in Yili, Xinjiang. Later, she lived a nomadic life. Even distant relatives dared not accept her because her documents were confiscated by the government, and others knew that her family was all in Kazakhstan; they were even more afraid to approach her. She could not even get into the hostel, and her immediate family was still in Kazakhstan. At first, Erbol Dauletbek came to our organization to defend his mother’s rights. He was willing to be a volunteer, so I accepted him. He didn’t know much, he didn’t understand other languages, and he didn’t understand the management of an organization. But as a result, this person was bribed by the State Security Agency, and many people saw him as the Security Agency’s plant in our organization. 

 

This person was in my second court session on August 19, 2019; he and my lawyer Aiman Umarova received “care” from the authorities. In the end, I terminated lawyer Ayman Umarova’s representation because she betrayed me. 

 

Why did you think the female lawyer betrayed you?  

 

Serikzhan Bilash: On August 16, 2019, everyone thought I would be released in court, and my lawyer at the time, Aiman Umarova, asked the court to extend my house arrest for another month because she had not thoroughly researched my case. My criminal file was five volumes — A4 papers, seven to eight hundred pages per volume, and five volumes in total. I saw through her and knew she had been bribed by the authorities and announced in court that she had given up her role as my lawyer and that Mr. Shynkuat Baizhanov would be my lawyer instead. 

  

On August 16, everyone thought the hearing was public, but the result would not be public. When she entered the hearing, she could raise objections, but she said: “okay.” I am against secret court hearings. The Procuratorate noted that many witnesses were under pressure from public opinion and retaliated. In order to protect the reputation and safety of the witnesses, they carried out the trial in secret to protect their reputation. The lawyer did not resist.  

 

What kind of witnesses needs protection? I said I’m going to have a public hearing. The Procuratorate said: “Have it in secret.” In fact, she had already been bribed at that time and been my lawyer for about half a year. She was just a lawyer to me. 

 

Did you choose her as your defense attorney at that time because of her expertise or were there other factors? 

  

Serikzhan Bilash: Lawyer Aiman Umarova, we all trusted her. In 2018, she received the “2018 International Women of Courage Award (IWOC)” from former U.S. first lady Melania Trump. After I was arrested on March 10, 2019, she was chosen as my attorney. In May 2019, Aiman Umarova was noticed by Tokayev, the second president of Kazakhstan. She was subsequently invited to join the “Assembly of People of Kazakhstan” established by the new president. 

Interestingly, the president sent her flowers. She showed off the Dutch roses that the president gave her on Facebook. This kind of rose’s length is longer than her body, and it is a costly type of rose. She took many photos to show it off. At that moment, I knew that she was bribed by authorities.  

 

That alone is not enough to convince people that she is a traitor. 

 

Serikzhan Bilash: Soon after, she criticized dissidents on social media. Why would a lawyer condemn dissidents? 

 

When I was arrested, the government asked me to criticize a dissident who was in exile in France. He was once jailed in Kazakhstan. His name is Mukhtar Ablyazov; on March 22, 2019, Nauryz, the Kazakh new year, Mukhtar Ablyazov called for a demonstration. The government asked me to criticize this opposition from an exiled dissident in France. I was at that time under house arrest, and I did not know the dissident; why should I criticize him? My lawyer at the time, Aiman Umarova, frequently criticized him online. You’re a lawyer; why would you criticize him for no reason? What was your purpose? 

 

This lawyer kept in touch with the second traitor I mentioned, Erbol Dauletbek. They also registered an Atajurt Eriktiler organization in September 2019 with the support of the National Security Agency of Kazakhstan. 

 

Did the authorities succeed in shaping their images? 

 

Serikzhan Bilash: The government tried to portray the first person (Erbol Dauletbek) as a human rights activist and let the Kazakhs from China follow him and oppose me, but it was unsuccessful. The people saw their true colors. Those witnesses could not get information about their family members in Xinjiang. When they later learned that some of their family members had been detained for 20 to 30 years, that organization told them that the concentration camps in Xinjiang did not exist. How could they believe this organization? So they called them degenerates and traitors of the nation. 

 

The government thought the first institution would be successful and secretly supported it, but in reality, they could not gain recognition. They set up a second organization in September 2019, thinking the second one would work, but they were also unsuccessful. 

 

Why is that so?  

 

 

Serikzhan Bilash: The reason is very simple, they said on Radio Free Europe: the Kazakhs detained by the Xinjiang authorities are all prisoners. The people saw their true colors at first glance. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

~Gao Zhensai, Special Correspondent of ChinaAid

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How Kazakhstan concealed Xinjiang concentration camps: ChinaAid’s exclusive interview with Serikzhan Bilash (part 2)

Serikzhan Bilash in New York, 2021 (Photo: Kalbynur Auken)
(ChinaAid) The following is part two of ChinaAid’s exclusive interview with Serikzhan Bilash, leader Atajurt Kazakh Human Rights. Bilash and ChinaAid Special Correspondent Gao Zhensai discuss how the Kazakhstan government attempted to control the narrative about Uyghurs and Kazakhs in Xinjiang concentration camps. Click here to read part one. 

 

Special Correspondent: Mr. Serikzhan, in the last interview, you mentioned your two like-minded friends, the activist Mr. Dulat Agadil and the writer Mr. Kuandyk Shamalhay, who are also your supporters. We would like to relay our deep condolences for their mysterious deaths. Politics is not absolute, but life is; divisions are not surprising, everyone’s ambition is to promote the progress of countries and human beings, and life is the bottom line that should not be crossed. When the last interview was done, it was coincidentally your friend’s birthday, but he had already passed. Your friend’s departure is an indication of potential threats against you. Have the authorities used other tools against you in the past few years? 

 

Serikzhan Bilash: The Kazakh authorities are afraid of us. We have influence in the West. We exposed the concentration camps. They want to arrest people like us, but they also have to take into account the pressure. The government has mixed feelings towards us. They have been using intimidation tactics. Even if they don’t use hardline tactics, they use soft tactics. The purpose of these soft tactics is an attempt to take advantage of the situation and mislead the West. 

 

Could you give any examples of this?  

 

Serikzhan Bilash: The State Security Agency of Kazakhstan bribed three members of our organization who betrayed us, and these three people were instigated. Two of these three people were instructed by the Kazakh government to register as human rights organizations with similar names, imitating our organization to make it easy to confuse the two. 

 

One of them, Kydyrali Orazuly, registered an organization in December 2018 within a short span of time called the “Atajurt Zhastary Youth Volunteer Organization” (Atajurt Zhastary). It was a foundation, a Chinese research institute. It also used “Atajurt,” which means “home of the father,” and it has two more characters, “Qing Nian” (youth), in its name. A week later, he registered another foundation. It usually takes two years to register an organization in Kazakhstan, and they were completed in one week. The other’s name was “Love Foundation” (“Bauyrmal”).  

 

This “traitor,” pardon me for calling him that, registered “Kazakhstan Institute of Chinese Study” a week later. In Kazakhstan, members of prominent families and high-level officials are needed as backers, and the application procedures are incredibly complicated to register for the institute. But he reached an agreement with the State Security Agency and registered three organizations at once, all in the city of Almaty. 

 

It is clear that you thought it was a fake separatist group formed by members who take a soft stance on China. What kind of challenge do these groups pose to you? 

 

Serikzhan Bilash: Kydyrali told Radio Free Europe that there are no concentration camps in Xinjiang and that ninety percent of all Kazakhs in Xinjiang have been released. The Kazakh government and China like to hear such words. 

 

That sounds paradoxical; since he denied the concentration camps, why did he say that ninety percent were released? Wouldn’t that be an admission that someone was detained and then released? And what about the other person? 

 

Serikzhan Bilash: Four months before my arrest in 2019, I found out the second man, Erbol Dauletbek, betrayed me. The State Security Agency would find him and started to bribe him. He defected in October 2018, when the State Security Agency made him an activist to have the people follow him. 

 

The second criminal investigation against me was “illegal appropriation of property.” It was Erbol Dauletbek who was trying to make things difficult for me; he said I was illegally occupying his organization’s YouTube channel. My channel started way back in 2013, many years before his organization. He got the approval of the government, applied for an organization, and tried to take over our YouTube channel to seize influence on a powerful platform used for speaking out. 

 

Maybe readers would be interested to know how he got into your organization?  

 

Serikzhan Bilash: He only joined us in September 2018. His mother was in her 80s and was placed under house arrest in Yili, Xinjiang. Later, she lived a nomadic life. Even distant relatives dared not accept her because her documents were confiscated by the government, and others knew that her family was all in Kazakhstan; they were even more afraid to approach her. She could not even get into the hostel, and her immediate family was still in Kazakhstan. At first, Erbol Dauletbek came to our organization to defend his mother’s rights. He was willing to be a volunteer, so I accepted him. He didn’t know much, he didn’t understand other languages, and he didn’t understand the management of an organization. But as a result, this person was bribed by the State Security Agency, and many people saw him as the Security Agency’s plant in our organization. 

 

This person was in my second court session on August 19, 2019; he and my lawyer Aiman Umarova received “care” from the authorities. In the end, I terminated lawyer Ayman Umarova’s representation because she betrayed me. 

 

Why did you think the female lawyer betrayed you?  

 

Serikzhan Bilash: On August 16, 2019, everyone thought I would be released in court, and my lawyer at the time, Aiman Umarova, asked the court to extend my house arrest for another month because she had not thoroughly researched my case. My criminal file was five volumes — A4 papers, seven to eight hundred pages per volume, and five volumes in total. I saw through her and knew she had been bribed by the authorities and announced in court that she had given up her role as my lawyer and that Mr. Shynkuat Baizhanov would be my lawyer instead. 

  

On August 16, everyone thought the hearing was public, but the result would not be public. When she entered the hearing, she could raise objections, but she said: “okay.” I am against secret court hearings. The Procuratorate noted that many witnesses were under pressure from public opinion and retaliated. In order to protect the reputation and safety of the witnesses, they carried out the trial in secret to protect their reputation. The lawyer did not resist.  

 

What kind of witnesses needs protection? I said I’m going to have a public hearing. The Procuratorate said: “Have it in secret.” In fact, she had already been bribed at that time and been my lawyer for about half a year. She was just a lawyer to me. 

 

Did you choose her as your defense attorney at that time because of her expertise or were there other factors? 

  

Serikzhan Bilash: Lawyer Aiman Umarova, we all trusted her. In 2018, she received the “2018 International Women of Courage Award (IWOC)” from former U.S. first lady Melania Trump. After I was arrested on March 10, 2019, she was chosen as my attorney. In May 2019, Aiman Umarova was noticed by Tokayev, the second president of Kazakhstan. She was subsequently invited to join the “Assembly of People of Kazakhstan” established by the new president. 

Interestingly, the president sent her flowers. She showed off the Dutch roses that the president gave her on Facebook. This kind of rose’s length is longer than her body, and it is a costly type of rose. She took many photos to show it off. At that moment, I knew that she was bribed by authorities.  

 

That alone is not enough to convince people that she is a traitor. 

 

Serikzhan Bilash: Soon after, she criticized dissidents on social media. Why would a lawyer condemn dissidents? 

 

When I was arrested, the government asked me to criticize a dissident who was in exile in France. He was once jailed in Kazakhstan. His name is Mukhtar Ablyazov; on March 22, 2019, Nauryz, the Kazakh new year, Mukhtar Ablyazov called for a demonstration. The government asked me to criticize this opposition from an exiled dissident in France. I was at that time under house arrest, and I did not know the dissident; why should I criticize him? My lawyer at the time, Aiman Umarova, frequently criticized him online. You’re a lawyer; why would you criticize him for no reason? What was your purpose? 

 

This lawyer kept in touch with the second traitor I mentioned, Erbol Dauletbek. They also registered an Atajurt Eriktiler organization in September 2019 with the support of the National Security Agency of Kazakhstan. 

 

Did the authorities succeed in shaping their images? 

 

Serikzhan Bilash: The government tried to portray the first person (Erbol Dauletbek) as a human rights activist and let the Kazakhs from China follow him and oppose me, but it was unsuccessful. The people saw their true colors. Those witnesses could not get information about their family members in Xinjiang. When they later learned that some of their family members had been detained for 20 to 30 years, that organization told them that the concentration camps in Xinjiang did not exist. How could they believe this organization? So they called them degenerates and traitors of the nation. 

 

The government thought the first institution would be successful and secretly supported it, but in reality, they could not gain recognition. They set up a second organization in September 2019, thinking the second one would work, but they were also unsuccessful. 

 

Why is that so?  

 

 

Serikzhan Bilash: The reason is very simple, they said on Radio Free Europe: the Kazakhs detained by the Xinjiang authorities are all prisoners. The people saw their true colors at first glance. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

~Gao Zhensai, Special Correspondent of ChinaAid

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Click Here
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